my sh 150 with mivv gp exhaust

Show off your new bike or favorite routes
User avatar
robber57
Admin
Posts: 995
Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 9:24 am
Location: Heerhugowaard,Holland

Re: my sh 150 with mivv gp exhaust

Post by robber57 » Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:41 am

You are mixing things up a bit.

The big spring located at the clutch has actually nothing to do with the clutch.
The complete rear part of the driven variator consists of 2 parts: the rear driven variator and the clutch.

The rear variator is pushed together with the big spring and so the big spring causes the belt to be tensioned, if you would take out the spring the belt would be slack.
Changing the big spring to a heavier one makes the belt more tight and capable of handling more horsepower without slipping.
So the big spring acts as a counter force for the roller weights at the front variator, if you would install a heavier spring you would also notice that it has the same effect as making the rollers lighter.
So you have 2 effects when making the spring heavier: the belt becomes more tight and the rpm goes up.
But making the belt more tight also causes more friction between belt and variator, more friction= loss of horsepower.
So you dont want to make the spring heavier if it is not necessary because it causes more friction in the belt and you will lose horsepower.
So if youre belt is not slipping you dont want to make the big spring heavier.



The 3 little springs inside the clutch determine at what rpm the clutch will be slipping and so also to what speed the clutch will be slipping and so also at what speed the clutch will go loose if you close the throttle.

Leave the big spring alone and just put in the 3 little green springs and see what happens, if the effect is not enough you can put in the blue or even the red springs.
Failure is not an option, it comes bundled with the package.

User avatar
Nikolaidis
Member
Posts: 148
Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2013 2:03 pm
Location: Athens,Grecce

Re: my sh 150 with mivv gp exhaust

Post by Nikolaidis » Fri Feb 15, 2013 8:44 am

I have changed the dbkiller !
It now seems that when i open the throttle goes slower than before.
I think i should change the rollers to 9.5 to gain the power back :roll:
Malossi TC Unit O2 Controller [Lamda Emulator]
Malossi Multivar MHR 9.5gr [RR] Dr.Pulleys with [white] contra spring
Malossi clutch springs [white]

Malossi Rs 24

Mivv Gp
DNA Air/Filter

User avatar
robber57
Admin
Posts: 995
Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 9:24 am
Location: Heerhugowaard,Holland

Re: my sh 150 with mivv gp exhaust

Post by robber57 » Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:21 am

That is possible, it is often hard to predict what will happen if you change something.
Getting more power is the aim and often you get more power but the question is "where?" , in the low in the mid or in the high rev's.
With a scooter this is not so easy to find out because the revs are controlled by the variator so sometimes you will have to change the variator to run at a different rpm to see what has happened.

Also keep in mind that sometimes you will have to change first something else to get the full benefit of a part, like changing the exhaust only makes a difference if you also change the vario.
Changing the db killer may need something done to the fuel injection to make it work like a fuel controller or lambda emulator.

This is the terrain where a dyno comes in handy but most of us dont have that at home and doing it at a shop costs quite some money, the going rate is usually something like 80 euro/hour or more or 25 euro per run.
And you have to disable the vario before you make the run otherwise you get a useless flat graph.

If you want to get further with this you may want to consider buying a accelerometer, if you have a smartphone with android/ios you can look in the app store as there are some app's which can use the build in acceleration sensor of the phone to plot a graph of the acceleration.

If you dont have a smartphone or dont want to get in to this you could consider buying a accelerometer from KOSO,it is more or less a digital speedo meter but it also has a stopwatch build in.
You need to put a sensor on the wheel and when you turn it on it can sense when you start to move and will start counting time until the limit speed is reached, so now you know how much time it took to go from 0 to 50 km/h, or from 20 to 60 km/h
Take a look: http://www.kosoeurope.com/racing
If the link doesnt work , you need to go to the "racing" part of the site , the whole site has been renewed so i am not sure where is what i mean, the "dyno" model is the most expensive but can do neat tricks like making a graph of you acceleration.
The DB-02(R) is also a good model, there is a battery powered model db-02 and a bike powered model db-02R, the battery powered model does not have a back-light.
You may notice that some/most of the models have a lot of functions and can take over youre whole dashboard if you would like that, if you dont want the additional functions(shift light,rpm,blinkers etc) its just simple; dont attach the sensors and these functions will not work.
Theres also a new model: http://www.kosoeurope.com/power-test.

This is how i attached mine:
IMG_0068.jpg
IMG_0070.jpg
I still need to make the sensor on the frontfork and wires so it does not function yet.

Keep in mind; you will have to fix this somehow to the original dashboard, make a 12 volt connection for it and attach at least a speed sensor to the front-fork/brake caliper, if you would take one with a tachometer in it you would also need to make a wire from the ignition coil to the meter.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Failure is not an option, it comes bundled with the package.

User avatar
Nikolaidis
Member
Posts: 148
Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2013 2:03 pm
Location: Athens,Grecce

Re: my sh 150 with mivv gp exhaust

Post by Nikolaidis » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:56 pm

thanks i'll check for any apps, though i think i might not need this... i prefer more the function of the logic to make this lol.
i stand for a while and i thought that i wana by the primary malossi gears, so i'm going tomorow to make an order to purchase them. i wonder what will be the effect if i only change that and no also the rollers.
Malossi TC Unit O2 Controller [Lamda Emulator]
Malossi Multivar MHR 9.5gr [RR] Dr.Pulleys with [white] contra spring
Malossi clutch springs [white]

Malossi Rs 24

Mivv Gp
DNA Air/Filter

User avatar
robber57
Admin
Posts: 995
Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 9:24 am
Location: Heerhugowaard,Holland

Re: my sh 150 with mivv gp exhaust

Post by robber57 » Sat Feb 16, 2013 4:24 am

Have you already closed the black hose?
It is a simple fix and solves a few things , one of the improvements is that the injection behavior becomes more stable and the exhaust doesnt become so terribly hot.(on a stainless steel exhaust heat is your enemy as it can cause the steel to break/crack)

On some days (rainy days) the sh will perform especially the first 15-30 minutes less, it seems like it has less horsepower, the plug in the hose will fix this a bit but not completely, to fix it all and to gain more power by the exhaust you have installed you should optimize the injection.

If youre worried about the difficulties with a programmable injection controller you could opt for the malossi O2 controller, it is a fixed box, there is nothing to adjust so you just install it between the wires (plug and play) of the Lambda sensor and thats it.
It makes the mixture richer , the engine delivers more horsepower and torque and the "rainy days" problem is completely gone provided that you also put the plug in the hose.

And yes; 9.5 grams is probably the way to go, if you install the malossi gears it will definitely be necessary.
Also keep in mind: over time the rollers will wear and the rpm will become a bit lower, so if you install lighter rollers and you have the feeling that they are a bit to light you may want to keep them as after a few (1000) km's the rpm will become lower.
Failure is not an option, it comes bundled with the package.

User avatar
Nikolaidis
Member
Posts: 148
Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2013 2:03 pm
Location: Athens,Grecce

Re: my sh 150 with mivv gp exhaust

Post by Nikolaidis » Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:44 am

I haven't close the black hose yet, i think i'll do it when i install the gears. I'll do it doe my concern of overheating as once you said. I start liking the backfire though.

One of my worries and also a concern is that changing the prime gears it might run the engine with more revs while i'm going slow.I don't want the sh to burn more fuel than it does now.
Do you think that even with the same weights (10.5)gr will rev faster??
Malossi TC Unit O2 Controller [Lamda Emulator]
Malossi Multivar MHR 9.5gr [RR] Dr.Pulleys with [white] contra spring
Malossi clutch springs [white]

Malossi Rs 24

Mivv Gp
DNA Air/Filter

User avatar
robber57
Admin
Posts: 995
Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 9:24 am
Location: Heerhugowaard,Holland

Re: my sh 150 with mivv gp exhaust

Post by robber57 » Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:45 am

Its the other way around, you make the gears longer so the engine will run slower thus enabling at full engine speed you will go faster.
Changing the gears had for me a positive effect on fuel consumption.
Downside is it is a tiny bit slower of the startline but after 1 week you will not notice this anymore.

The backfire is indeed a cool sound but all this heat in the exhaust is definitely not, i have driven my Yasuni for 6 months without the plug in and a few weeks ago my exhaust broke in 2.(its now 14 months old)
Of course i dont know if this would not have happen if i would have put the plug in immediately ,stainless steel exhausts have a tendency to break over time, the hotter you make it the sooner it will break but in the end they all will break.

The rollers is a complicated story, i hope i can make you understand this:
The RPM you get with a set of rollers depends on the "load" you put on the bike, the heavier the load the lower the rpm will be, with a light load the rpm will be higher.

If you put longer gears in the engine the load on the vario will be higher and so the rpm will go down, to compensate for this you will have to put in lighter rollers to get the rpm you had before the changed gears.
The same goes for putting a passenger on the bike or a trailer behind it; you make the load heavier and so the rpm will go down.

example: if i put my trailer behind my SH the rpm of the engine is lower then normal.
Failure is not an option, it comes bundled with the package.

User avatar
Nikolaidis
Member
Posts: 148
Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2013 2:03 pm
Location: Athens,Grecce

Re: my sh 150 with mivv gp exhaust

Post by Nikolaidis » Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:16 pm

What if i install the second gears, will i have better acceleration? Once i read that changing those is like changing for ex: a gear on the bicycle from small to a bigger... that means that ill have more acceleration, but would i need with this adjustment to change rollers... :?

My exhaust is not from steel.. well maybe inside but outside is titanium so she can resist on more Celsius degrees . . . is what i think
Malossi TC Unit O2 Controller [Lamda Emulator]
Malossi Multivar MHR 9.5gr [RR] Dr.Pulleys with [white] contra spring
Malossi clutch springs [white]

Malossi Rs 24

Mivv Gp
DNA Air/Filter

User avatar
Nikolaidis
Member
Posts: 148
Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2013 2:03 pm
Location: Athens,Grecce

Re: my sh 150 with mivv gp exhaust

Post by Nikolaidis » Mon Feb 18, 2013 8:09 am

I have putted in the air hose today a metalic ball. I think though that with the pressure of the air going out of the engine [in the hose] will pop it out... Does it have good amount of pressure there ?
Malossi TC Unit O2 Controller [Lamda Emulator]
Malossi Multivar MHR 9.5gr [RR] Dr.Pulleys with [white] contra spring
Malossi clutch springs [white]

Malossi Rs 24

Mivv Gp
DNA Air/Filter

User avatar
robber57
Admin
Posts: 995
Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 9:24 am
Location: Heerhugowaard,Holland

Re: my sh 150 with mivv gp exhaust

Post by robber57 » Mon Feb 18, 2013 4:08 pm

If the ball is a bit bigger then the hose it will stay there, there is not much pressure in the hose as the exhaust gases are kept away by the steel membrane.

Youre exhaust is indeed made of titanium but that doesnt make all of a difference on cracking, titanium exhaust also breaks after prolonged heating up and cooling down cycles but it is more resilient then stainless, you are right on that.

On the gears; all gears you can buy for the SH are "longer"(a higher gear ratio) which means they give the bike the possibility for a higher topspeed and this gain in topspeed has the consequence of a bit lower acceleration.
The gain in topspeed is not huge and so the loss in acceleration is also not huge,with your roller setup you will still outrun any other standard SH.

If you want more acceleration you should install the green/blue/red springs.
Failure is not an option, it comes bundled with the package.

Post Reply